Leaf Spring Options

Bottoms out? Shimmies? Shackles, springs, shocks, steering linkage etc. The old messages from the NPCA 'Suspension' category are here.

Postby moore_rb » Mon Jan 15, 2018 10:19 am

Those look really nice, Mr Toad.

I like your tires, too :D
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L-R:
White 65 Hardtop L60-3-00617 (undergoing restoration)
Red 65 hardtop 4L60-002565 (scrapped for parts)
66 Hardtop "El-Bondo Patrol", L60-00511 (Restored, then sold June2020)
Blue 67 Hardtop (sold March1997)
Green 62 Softtop L60-2-00504 (undergoing restoration)
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Postby Toads Patrol » Sun Jan 28, 2018 12:33 pm

5777
rear ride height with Alcans

So the Alcan springs raised the ride height. Front is jacked up while working on steering. Because of the raised ride, the steering center has moved such that I drive down the road with wheel approx 90 deg to where it was.
question to y'all is do I pull the steering wheel and realign on the splines to the 12 oclock position, or is there another adjustment (I dont see one)
Thanks
Mr. Toad: A motorcar! Gad... what have I been missing? (Wind in the Willows)
67 L60 Hardtop (since 1982)
68 SRL311 (2000 Solex, since 1974)
91 Figaro


Sordid past: 69 SRL311, 69 L521 (KIA), 70 B110, 72 240Z, 72 510 Wagon, 80 720 (KIA), 87 Stanza (KIA), 88 D21, 05 350Z, 10 Versa (KIA - totaled)
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Postby Esteban » Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:34 am

Toads Patrol wrote:So the Alcan springs raised the ride height. Front is jacked up while working on steering. Because of the raised ride, the steering center has moved such that I drive down the road with wheel approx 90 deg to where it was.
question to y'all is do I pull the steering wheel and realign on the splines to the 12 oclock position, or is there another adjustment (I dont see one)
Thanks


I don't see any other as well. Very interesting what you mention about the shift of position of the steering wheel. This will help other membes avoiding scratching their head trying to look for an explanation. Probably the shim that you added to the springs for the pitman arm attachment also contributed a tiny bit to compound this.
Owner of the same Patrol since 1967
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Postby Kdiv_n_tx » Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:22 pm

Same issue here after installing new Alcans - my steering wheel is roughly 75 degrees left of center. It bugs me on occasion but I have largely gotten over it. Monitoring this thread to see if there is a solution.
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Postby r1lark » Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:15 pm

Toads Patrol wrote:Because of the raised ride, the steering center has moved such that I drive down the road with wheel approx 90 deg to where it was. question to y'all is do I pull the steering wheel and realign on the splines to the 12 oclock position, or is there another adjustment (I dont see one)
Thanks


I don't have my Patrol here to look at what other adjustments may be possible. But........every steering box I have ever worked on has a 'high spot' in the center of it's travel. The high spot is meant to be the 'straight ahead' position. Assuming your steering was pretty much correct before the new springs -- the high spot at the straight ahead position -- you don't want to just reposition the steering wheel.

As I mentioned, my Patrol is not handy to study. But it seems to me that raising the ride height with springs could cause the drag link (the connection between the steering pitman arm and the steering knuckle on the opposite side) to be at a steeper angle, which would impact the effective horizontal measurement between the steering box pitman arm and the opposite steering knuckle. When the effective horizontal distance between the pitman arm and steering knuckle changes, your steering wheel will no longer be centered when you are going straight forward.

Can the drag link can safely be adjusted to change its length? Not sure if those ends actually have much if any adjustment capability. I've tried to post a picture of the steering linkage that Esteban posted in another thread, but it kept telling me the forum couldn't determine it's size?? I've posted the link to the thread here:
http://www.60patrol.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=4273

I may be all wet here, but throwing this out as a possibility. Comments and corrections are more than welcome!!
Paul
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Postby RiverPatrol » Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:37 am

What puzzles me is that by replacing the springs the Patrol is merely returning to it's original ride height. What has changed in the steering in the years that the original springs sagged? Alignment? Pitman rebuilds? Why did the steering wheel stay centered during the period of sag? I've experienced the same thing on my own vehicles and never came up with a solution. Some were worse than others.
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Postby Flaggoni » Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:06 pm

I suspect that, over the years, as suspensions sagged, steering wheels were recentered as part of a wheel-alignment check/adjustment. Most vehicles came with two adjustment turnbarrel-type sleeves on the tie rods. This allowed for toe-in adjustment as well as steering wheel centering.
If, as in the Patrol, there is only one threaded adjustment, it was normal as the last alignment procedure, to re-index the steering wheel splines to re-center the wheel.
My Patrol’s wheel was not centered when I purchased it with its tired springs. I re-centered it, drove for a couple years, then fixed the saggy springs to original height, then re-re-centered the splines.
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Postby Toads Patrol » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:37 pm

5785
steering wheel displacement

5782
Alcan stance

5784
Alcan front

5783
Alcan rear
Split rims - great fun and very dangerous - get the truck depot experts to mount these!

Definitely sits higher with the replacement springs. Without measuring, how does this look? And boy are they stiff. Test drive will wait till the weather gets better (salted roads here).
It is as indicated in the above posts a matter of geometry. The steering box is fixed to the frame - if you raise the ride height the front axle effectively drops with respect to the frame and the drag link pulls the steering to the left. Therefore the wheel is turned right to return the center steering.
90 deg is no big offset in the grand scheme of full range of the steering box. If this was the factory ride height being restored then re-centering is the actual and original center. If not, and you wanted to adjust i suppose you could pull the pitman arm off the steering box and move over one spline (dont know if this is doable) I suspect one spline is more than 90 deg of wheel motion. At any rate I'm having the steering wheel re-centered.
Mr. Toad: A motorcar! Gad... what have I been missing? (Wind in the Willows)
67 L60 Hardtop (since 1982)
68 SRL311 (2000 Solex, since 1974)
91 Figaro


Sordid past: 69 SRL311, 69 L521 (KIA), 70 B110, 72 240Z, 72 510 Wagon, 80 720 (KIA), 87 Stanza (KIA), 88 D21, 05 350Z, 10 Versa (KIA - totaled)
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Postby Toads Patrol » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:43 pm

And one additional item which Esteban alluded to. When I tightened up the drag link to take the slop out of it it may have effectively shortened the drag link distance with the same result of pulling the steering to the left. As both the springs and steering were done at the same time I don't know which was the culprit. MAybe both?
Mr. Toad: A motorcar! Gad... what have I been missing? (Wind in the Willows)
67 L60 Hardtop (since 1982)
68 SRL311 (2000 Solex, since 1974)
91 Figaro


Sordid past: 69 SRL311, 69 L521 (KIA), 70 B110, 72 240Z, 72 510 Wagon, 80 720 (KIA), 87 Stanza (KIA), 88 D21, 05 350Z, 10 Versa (KIA - totaled)
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Postby RiverPatrol » Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:21 pm

Toads Patrol wrote:And one additional item which Esteban alluded to. When I tightened up the drag link to take the slop out of it it may have effectively shortened the drag link distance with the same result of pulling the steering to the left. As both the springs and steering were done at the same time I don't know which was the culprit. MAybe both?


Possibly both. I've replaced springs on several and always noticed some change in the steering wheel.

Your stance looks great. It might be a little higher than stock but they'll settle a little after driving a bit. This is what stock stance looked like:

1964_Datsun_Patrol_brochure_lhd-1_fp.jpg
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