60Patrol

L60Boerne wrote:Thanks Plateaucal,

Three more clues are;
a). it clicks when you push the starter
b). It can be pull started
c). The battery is charged and the wiring was really hot leading to the fuse box. I asked #2 which wire was hot and where it came/went and did not get a straight answer.

Regardless of all this the starter was dragging really bad when I pushed the starter button. That needs to be fixed at some point as well.

a) means the solenoid is probably working fine
b) means the ignition system is ok
c) goes hand in hand with the blown "add on" wire

Heat is the power by-product of resistance to current flow. Power either: 1) makes the starter work, or 2) gets lost as heat energy.

the dragging starter also goes with C, and tells me you have a high resistance issue in the system- Plateaucal has covered all the bases inside the starter itself, except one: The main shaft has to be able to spin freely within the case bearings. I have "resurrected" many slow turning, high effort starters through the years with little more than a couple strategic squirts of wd40 on both ends of the main shaft, and on the jump gear. If all the moving parts in the starter can move freely and easily, then they will require less power/current from the battery to do their job.

also, make sure the starter is properly grounded- There should be a fat ground wire going from the solenoid to the starter housing, and a second ground strap or wire going from the starter housing, to a cleaned off spot on the truck's frame. DON'T rely on the starter's mounting bolts to provide adequate ground- give the starter coils a free path to the negative battery cable via the truck's frame

lastly - check the condition of the positive battery cable itself, and the connectors at both ends. Did the positive cable also get hot when you tried to crank it?

this "add on wire" might be a jumper that is bypassing the starter relay from the starter button, which would be BAD, because the starter button is not supposed to handle the full amperage necessary to engage the solenoid plunger- That's what the relay is there for.

Starter wiring is the 2nd most complicated circuit on these old trucks (turn signals are number 1 ) - The starter system is a sequence of cascading switches: key energizes starter button, starter button energizes the "weak side" of the starter relay, so that the "strong side" of the starter relay can supply battery voltage to the starter solenoid, until starter solenoid snaps shut making the *click" that you hear, which provides full, unencumbered battery cranking amperage directly to the starter motor (assuming the other side of the motor coils are properly grounded back to the negative)

When it's all working, nothing should get hot, and that electric motor should be able to turn the engine until either a spark plug fires, or the battery runs out of juice.

And to clarify, the problem I had with mine was voltage drop to the solenoid due to corroded connection. It would operate the solenoid but not enough to engage the starter except once in a while. Not until after my starter mechanic proclaimed that all was well with the starter did I look for other causes.

Ultimately, your starter should be repairable and a little inspection of all your wiring and and connections are warranted.

Thank you, I'm getting this info out to our mechanic right now.

Greetings,
We had a great hunt thus weekend collecting a really nice trophy Axis buck in the 109 degree heat for a friend. He was so excited. At times I too was excited. So excited I might have ran over a tree slightly too big. We made it back to camp just ahead of the first rain in 6 weeks.

However, I discovered Santa's Sleigh doesn't have a skid plate over the oil pan. Does anyone have one they will sell me that fits my 65?

Lastly, any advice on the oil pan gasket would be appreciated. Can that goo in a tube make a good one or do I need to search for a real gasket?

Patrolling for parts...again,
L60Boerne

Robert says that goo in tube works well and I am sure he will show up in 3-2-1. I am inclined to believe him. He wrote a brief description of his process somewhere. I'd hit the local metal shop to see if they can make a skid plate. Worst case, if you cannot find one but really want one perhaps someone can come up with a basic pattern that can be bent from sheet.

That being said, damn I am jealous.

L60Boerne wrote:...
Lastly, any advice on the oil pan gasket would be appreciated. Can that goo in a tube make a good one or do I need to search for a real gasket?
L60Boerne

I've been using silicone Permatex Ultra Grey for ages, including the oil pan. Mine has already 16 years on the clock and some 20k miles. I highly recommend it. In fact, I quit putting cork or paper gaskets all over a couple of decades ago. A 1/8" bead will work on the oil pan.

This are the instructions from the manufacturer:

1. For best results, clean and dry all surfaces with a residue-free solvent such as Permatex® Brake & Parts Cleaner.

2. Cut nozzle to desired bead size. Gaskets are best formed using a 1/16″ to 1/4″ (2 to 6 mm) bead.

3. Apply a continuous, even bead of silicone to one surface, surrounding all bolt holes. Assemble parts immediately while silicone is still wet. Finger tighten until material begins to squeeze out around flange. Allow to dry for one hour then retighten 1/4 to 1/2 turn.

4. Silicone will skin over in one hour and fully cure in 24 hours under normal conditions. Allow more time for cold or very dry conditions. Clean uncured silicone from hands, tools and clothing with Permatex® Fast Orange® Wipes or Fast Orange® Hand Cleaner.

The problem with the cork gasket for the oil pan, is that the original one is unobtanium, and the aftermarket ones are rather thin. On top of that, there's little deformation where the bolts go, due to previous tightening, and it causes the cork to fail prematurely.

I know the purists don't like this stuff. For me, function trumps originality, specially on leaks.

What he said, especially about the gray Permatex- That is also my favorite for diff covers, and oil pans.

the only thing I do slightly differently is I snug all the bolts, and then I let it sit longer (4-6 hours, overnight will also work) before I torque the bolts to spec in an alternating sequence (I think oil pan bolts get about 12-15 ft/lbs)

Esteban wrote:

L60Boerne wrote:...
Lastly, any advice on the oil pan gasket would be appreciated. Can that goo in a tube make a good one or do I need to search for a real gasket?
L60Boerne

I've been using silicone Permatex Ultra Grey for ages, including the oil pan. Mine has already 16 years on the clock and some 20k miles. I highly recommend it. In fact, I quit putting cork or paper gaskets all over a couple of decades ago. A 1/8" bead will work on the oil pan.

This are the instructions from the manufacturer:

1. For best results, clean and dry all surfaces with a residue-free solvent such as Permatex® Brake & Parts Cleaner.

2. Cut nozzle to desired bead size. Gaskets are best formed using a 1/16″ to 1/4″ (2 to 6 mm) bead.

3. Apply a continuous, even bead of silicone to one surface, surrounding all bolt holes. Assemble parts immediately while silicone is still wet. Finger tighten until material begins to squeeze out around flange. Allow to dry for one hour then retighten 1/4 to 1/2 turn.



These guys...I wish I had them as neighbors.
4. Silicone will skin over in one hour and fully cure in 24 hours under normal conditions. Allow more time for cold or very dry conditions. Clean uncured silicone from hands, tools and clothing with Permatex® Fast Orange® Wipes or Fast Orange® Hand Cleaner.

The problem with the cork gasket for the oil pan, is that the original one is unobtanium, and the aftermarket ones are rather thin. On top of that, there's little deformation where the bolts go, due to previous tightening, and it causes the cork to fail prematurely.

I know the purists don't like this stuff. For me, function trumps originality, specially on leaks.

You guys were a few minutes late. Dang.

Greetings from Red Rocks,

Santa's Sleigh has found a new workshop. Liar's Lair is no more. It was a good run with excellent hunting but in recent years the land owner shifted to intensive goat and sheep ranching. Liar's Lair went from a lush winter haven for wildlife to a wasteland with only tree trunks and dirt. Furthermore, our recent freeze killed 90% of the exotic animals in the area.

The good news is that Santa's Sleigh has been transported to The Llano Lair. The Llano Lair is a haven for wildlife with beautiful outcrops of red granite and limestone.It is a very rare location where the limestone hills formed from Cretaceous Period reefs meets the much much older igneous pink granite, which was mined nearby to build the Texas Capitol building in Austin. The camping, hiking and hunting terrain is spectacular as it the small log cabin overlooking the pond.

I switched to a new phone and am hesitant to upload a picture cropping/resizing app to upload pictures because my IT guys those are loaded with bugs. But I likely will upload an app soon. Still checking it out.

The Llano Lair is about 15 miles west of Llano, TX.

Santa's Sleigh is running great and Scott finally fixed all the leaks. I drive it almost every weekend.

Patrolling again soon,
L60Boerne

That is sad news to hear about Lair's Lair, especially the demise of the exotics. Good that you have found a new location that suffices.

You don't really need a resizing app on your phone. When I send pics in email with my phone it always prompts me to choose what size to send the pictures. I select large. I send the email to myself and when I receive it the picture is resized perfectly to upload here.